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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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Hi. <br />First of all I'd like to thank John Dunlop for turning me on to the SeaRey 'Pot-O-Gold' this site seems to be. I've spent a couple days reading through the site , front to back. I understand the real meat is in the Technical Site which I don't have access to...yet. First, a little about myself: I grew up flying with my dad. He always had floatplanes and we'd frequently go lake hopping. I have a private certification (SEL) obtained in 1990. I haven't flown for several years due to life getting in the way but am finally in a position to get back to pursuing my life long dream of owning an amphib. I live in MN and have a cabin on one of the lakes in the central part of the state. <br /><br />I've been aware of the evolution of the SeaRey since the beginning -from it's roots in the Buccaneer to what it is now - but wasn't ever in a position to seriously look at it. Until now. So here's my current situation: I'm torn between building vs. buying. I think I understand the benefits and downfalls of both sides - primarily time vs. money, personal skill level vs. other's skill levels and old vs. new. Any advice or opinions on this?<br /><br />I've run across a local SeaRey that's for sale. It's a mid 90's with an 80 horse. TT280. I was wondering what advice you could provide primarily:<br /><br />1. What improvements/enhancements/upgrades/options have been made since the mid 90's and are these retrofit-able to this particular aircraft. It has a 'B' hull and I understand the 'C' hull is the one to have. I heard this can be retrofitted. Anything else- Gear? Airframe? Controls? etc?<br />2. What, in particular, should one look for when considering a used Rey of this vintage?<br />3. Do you know of anyone local(ish) to MN that could/would provide an experienced opinion?(compensated, of course)<br />3. Do you know of anyone local(ish) to MN that could/would provide training for the SeaRey?<br /><br />Also, being in MN, I'm particularly interested in Bruno's snow ski experiment. Hope this works out ok as it's something I'd surely want to do.<br /><br />Regarding the Technical Site - Is there ever any special dispensation given to allow access by non-owners? Limited, observe only type priveleges? It would certainly help my research and strategizing for my impending purchase.<br /><br />Thanks for reading this long-winded post. I truly appreciate any insight you can provide. Thanks in advance<br /><br />-Tim
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Kenneth Leonard - Aug 14,2008
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Tim - before I committed, I also really wished I had access to a technical site - I didn't know it existed - but searched mightily across the web for non-factory info on the 'Rey. So I empathize with you. Apparently, a competitor used access to an older site to post things about the Searey in attempt to make his product look better. That can lead to owners not being forthright in their honest criticism of the bird - criticism that has resulted in many, many improvements over the years. There are several individuals on this site with gobs of Searey experience that you might want to contact off-line. I do not have enough experience to qualify as one of those. If you already have talked with John Dunlop, you've found one. He's a dealer, but he's been above the board on everything I've seen in the last 3 years.<br />
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Tom Rammel - Aug 14,2008
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Tim, I also live in MN and you can come and see my Searey if you would like. I live in Cokato near hwy 12. I am in the process of rebuilding my searey and just installed the C hull. I do not consider myself an expert but everyone you can talk to adds some insite. My Daughter gets married this saturday 8/16/08 but any time after that would be good. rammel@sytekcom.com or 320-286-5283
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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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I knew this was the right place - Thanks gentlemen.<br /><br />Ken - Thanks. I understand the conundrum. Maybe a strategy for the admins of the site could be to allow 'casual observers' with no posting priveleges until they've proven ownership. I think it could help build the community once folks realized the tremendous resource available to owners. I've gotten some info from John - very quick and friendly response, I might add. I tend to ask a LOT of questions and exhaustively research these sorts of things so I can make educated decisions. I might need to spread the questions around  <br /><br />Tom - Thanks for your generous offer. I'd love to take you up on it. Incidently, the Rey that's for sale is in nearby Winsted. I'll be contacting you to arrange a visit. <br />Oh, and Congrats to you and your Daughter!<br /><br />Thanks for your input
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Frank A. Carr - Aug 14,2008
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Tim,I built and never considered buying. I guess I must have wanted the challenge. I succeeded. It was a challenge. Still is. Building never ends even after flying begins. Took me 5 years + (including building a new home) and ~2000 hours not including shopping, scratching my head, typing questions on the STS, calling the factory, attending air-shows to look, visiting the factory and other SeaReys to get tips, etc., etc. The cost exceeded my plan by a factor of 3. If you love challenge, frustration, building something, headaches, learning, and the self-satisfaction of building--don't miss the opportunity to test your patience. If you're in a hurry to fly and have fun, buy.<!-- >'"><br><font color=red size=6>' or > missing in user HTML. Please fix the HTML.</font> -->
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Doug Harvey - Aug 16,2008
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To you ole Searey boys,,,, I am looking at a Searey to be used in primairly Salt water.... do ANY of you have words of wisdom as to prior precautions that I can have built into a factory built plane??????? Pls come back with sites, comments, and people that I can talk with about Salt water wash-down plates, any thing that can be built into the frame prior to covering..... coating that can be placed on frame areas.... drain plugs, etc... I understand the wheel bearing problems, but,,, what else....????<br />Doug Harvey E dhar42@aol.com
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Dennis Scearce - Aug 14,2008
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Tim: I purchased my Searey already built because I didn't have time to build one. I still want to build one but, if you want to fly, there's nothing wrong with buying a good used one. Emphasis on the word 'good'. Mine only had 42 hours on it but had a lot of things wrong with it that only a Searey expert would know. I had an A&P look it over before I bought it and it had a recent annual - neither found the things that I had to eventually change after becoming familiar with the brand. If I were to do it over again, I'd pay Paige Lynette, or Dan Nickens, or John Dunlop or one of the other pros to come look over the plane and fly it for me. Had I done that, I would have probably not purchased this plane but waited for a better one. Don't kid yourself - if it's a 'good buy', you will eventually spend the difference on bringing it up to a good plane. When I think about what I didn't know on my maiden voyage from Owego, NY to Mooresville, NC, it scares the heck out of me. I have a good plane now but the total investment is no bargain. Get a Searey owner with years of flying / building time to look it over for you.
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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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Hi Frank. <br />5 years?! 2000 hrs?! Is this an anomoly or is it 'normal' (if such a category exists) for the SeaRey. Is there a group average for the site? This is what scares me with buliding. Time and cost. I don't know that I'd take it on knowing that it was going to be 5 years down the road before I could fly it. 1-2 years maybe. Maybe. I'm guessing that's what just about everyone figures though - 'Ahhh, maybe 6 mos. to a year and I'll be flying'. 5 years later... Did you approach this with a 5 year time frame? I love building things. Such a dilemma.<br /><br />About the cost - I've just spoken to Kerry Richter. He honestly thinks $55-60k in the air, nicely equipped. Realistic? How did you exceed the budget by 3 times the amount, Frank? It seems like a fairly complete kit (from a rookie's point of view). Was it in the panel? Paint?<br />Thanks for the guidance.<br />Tim
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Frank A. Carr - Aug 14,2008
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Tim,I would not quibble with Kerry's estimate. I'm in the low 60's. What I should have said was that I wound up 3 times over the cost of the kit--which in my day was around $20K. My basic kit did not include the engine, prop, BRS, exhaust, avionics, paint, and gilhooyies.As for the time frame--besides the house that I mentioned above--I'm careful, slow, and basically ignorant. But I thoroughly enjoyed every hour working on the SeaRey! I still do. Moreover, I'd not trade the experience, period. Maybe to some, flying is fun but to others, building is better. Why not have both?<!-- >'"><br><font color=red size=6>' or > missing in user HTML. Please fix the HTML.</font> -->
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Tom Rammel - Aug 14,2008
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Tim, my first build took 8 months, 945 hours in 8 months. That was - go to work build sleep and do it again the next day nothing else. <br />I know Kevin in Winsted He also has a nice RV airplane. Where do you live in MN?
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Bill Fosdick - Aug 14,2008
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Tim,<br /><br />I bought a 3rd hand SeaRey, 80 hp, B hull, elec/hyd gear, elec flaps with 213 hrs on it. I lucked out and got a good one and have to do very little to correct past problems, although you will always have some of that. I wanted to fly more than I wanted to build. Nobody had clued me into the SeaRey sites until after I purchased but I don't think that would have changed anything. Look at it real close and have as many eyes as you can get look for you. By the way, I think the B hull does just fine. Call me anytime if you need further. 540-872-6744
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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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Hi Dennis. Thanks for chiming in. That's kind of what I'm thinking too - have an expert wring it out.<br /><br />Tom-That's kind of how I am. When I get focused - say goodbye to friends and family. They won't see me for a while. How was your final cost compared to original expectations? Are you familiar with Kevins SeaRey? I confused about something - It's listed as registered as an E-LSA. It seems too old for that category and, correct me if I'm wrong, doesn't the Manufaturer have to have the aircraft certified as an S-LSA before their kits can be registered as an E-LSA? The E-LSA would be better for someone buying a used plane as they could obtain their Repairman-Inspector certification and perform their own inspections. But I'm skeptical in this case. I'm in Elk River. Work in Golden Valley. I have a cabin on Baby Lake in the Walker/Hackensack/Longville area.<br /><br />How big of a difference does the C hull make compared to an early B hull? Is it worth the upgrade hassle?<br /><br />To help do an accurate comparison on used vs. building, is there a preferred upgrade/options/equipment list that's generally agreed upon?<br /><br />Thanks everyone!<br />-Tim
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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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Frank - Thanks for the explanation. I guess another advantage to building would be not having to plop down the entire bankroll at one time.<br /><br />Hi Bill. Thanks for joining in and thanks for the phone support offer. You might be sorry <br /><br />Tom - posting the picture is just plain cruel . It's beautiful.<br /><br />-Tim
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Dan Nickens - Aug 14,2008
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As Ken pointed out, Tim, there is a very active and excellent technical site for SeaRey owners. This site is reserved solely for social purposes. Unfortunately the information you need to evaluate your options is of a very technical nature. There are many SeaRey owners on this site that love to talk technical and I'm sure would be happy to respond to you off-line. In fact, let me use this occassion to invite them to do so. Meanwhile, let's get back to the fun stuff here.
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Tim Benzie - Aug 14,2008
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Sorry Dan. I was wondering when/if this may happen. Sorry if I led the site a-stray. It's sorta like having the cookie jar on the top shelf and your shoes are nailed to the floor - just outta reach. I expect many of you may have been here. I've heard from a couple folks off-line and would welcome any more that are willing. Thanks very much to all that have contributed. Hope to see you on the Tech site someday!<br />-Tim
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Dan Nickens - Aug 14,2008
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No worries, mate. It will be a great pleasure to see you on the Tech site.
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Dave Edward - Aug 15,2008
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Hi Tim...I think I know how you feel. I grew up around airplanes...in fact, was almost born in one in 1938. My dad was a bush pilot and when Trans Canada Airlines ( now Air Canada ) was formed,he became one of it's earliest pilots. I did some flying in a SeaBee when I was a kid and some light airplane stuff while in high school. Joined the RCAF in '56 and TCA/AC in 1958, flying Viscounts at age 20. I retired as # 1 on the senority list flying the 747-400 in '98 with just over 32,000 hrs. I got a float endorsement during that period.<br />As retirement loomed, my wife asked if I was going to get an airplane or were we going to get a divorce. Lynn and I drove all over the eastern part of Canada looking at airplanes for sale. I wanted a hull but couldn't ratonalize the expenditure or operating cost of a SeaBee or a 'real floatplane '. My eldest son had flown the bush and was a pilot with AC and wanted me to buy a C-185 on floats. Lynn and I went to SnF in '99 and we saw the SeaRey and the KOLB. <br />Building was never a consideration. I knew that I didn't have the knowledge...patience or skill to do that....plus, the stats showed that 50% of kits never get completed and of the 50% that do, 50% get flown just a couple of times. There are builders and there are those that just want to fly. Then there are a very few who do both well and with enthusiasim..<br />IDK 070 came on the market and I became it's 3rd owner. I had a pilot/AME friend go over it prior to purchase and after a very inadaquete instruction/ checkout started back to enjoyable seat of the pants flying, ...and learning!! I spent $5000.00 upgrading the airplane the first winter it was in storage. A local FBO AME removed all the non aviation hardware and installed the wingtip extensions...strobes...u/c components which I had brought back from a visit to PA. <br />My second year, I was fortunate indeed to have Dan & Ann Nickens drop in to our place in the Bush Husky they had just purchased. Dan flew with me in VMU and in 2 hours of flying with him, I learned more about the SeaRey than I could absorb. I had met Dan through this site.<br />Since then, with the help of Dave King, I have done upgrade / mtce and the airplane is very reliable and still gives me the joy and satisfaction of ' REAL FLYING.'.I have flown 585 hrs of basically trouble free flying. A couple of gear collapses and only two real scares due to improper handing of gust windy conditions. I still have the ' A ' hull , much to some of this groups disgust and if I were to do it again, would get the CF 'C' hull . I have manual gear..manual flaps and none of that ' gee whiz ' stuff which I consider frivolent and unnecessary for the kind of fun flying I do. My 15 year old grandson is 1/2 way through his PPL course and flys the SeaRey like he was born in it.<br />I envy those of this group who are builders and flyers. <br />My suggestion to you is....buy a C hull kit with the 912S...get Frank Nordhuis or one of the other gurus to build it for you...ASAP , and start flying it next summer. That's what I'll do in my next lfe.<br /><br />Sorry to be so long winded....Listen to Dan N....John D.....Rob L and the guys @ PA.<br />You won't go wrong and the smile on your face will be priceless.<br />Good Luck....Dave
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Philip Mendelson - Aug 16,2008
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I have to agree with Dave. A new C-Hull with a New engine is really in your best<br />interest. I have done both, I started with a used airplane which was a night mare.<br />Had a new one built, which I absolutly LOVE! If your wife and budget allows buy<br />a new airplane and have it built to your taste! Enough said!
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Terry Eliason - Aug 20,2008
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Tim, My name is Terry Eliason. I live in Morrison county about 20 miles north of Little Falls, MN. Give me a call 218-575-2632....SeaRey owner N342TC.
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Ross Vining - Aug 21,2008
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Tim<br />The Searey was the first plane I built. It took me 950 hours, I worked on it for one long day (10 hours) <br />most weekends for 2 years. It should not have taken that long, I fiddled a fair bit. I later built a second <br />SeaRey - That took about 650 hours. I am in Australia where most Seareys never get to see fresh water, <br />we operate off Salt almost exclusively.<br />The Australian SeaREy Agent, Rob Loneragan, is probably the best one to talk to about preparation for <br />salt water preparation. regards Ross Vining - Adelaide - South Australia
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